As a matter of fact, I can think of two hot course 6 males right now.

And that's exactly why I'm not writing my course 11 paper!

Thanks for the post =). One of the things my dad said to me when I was young was, "if you don't get rejected, you're not trying hard enough." And that applies here more than ever. Even though I got rejected, I know that I've tried my hardest and lived life to the fullest. Seeing as how this is probably the last time I will ever visit this site, I just want to say thanks for the experiences. And all you MIT people truly are brilliant.

Thanks for the post Laura. I agree with you. I was rejected yesterday, and yes, I was angry at myself for a while because I but so much time and effort into the application, and yes, I was really disappointed, but still, life goes on.

Applying here was such a great experience, and when I visited I absolutely loved it. Just having lived through that was something I'll never forget.

Thanks for all the advice and comfort you've given all of us applicants Laura.

Good luck!

Some guy made a post detailing how appalled he was at the fact that the admit rate for females is far higher than that for males.

But let's all think about this for a minute. If there's about a 1:1 male:female ratio at MIT, and there's about a 3:1 male:female applicant ratio, then that would make sense, no?

I still feel like there's a glaring error in there somewhere, whether it be ethical or mathematical, but I'm not going to go into that. I'll only end up ranting, I'm sure.

I've got better things to do at MIT than being someone's girlfriend. X chromosomes, psh. The guys have one of them too ;-) Although thekeri is right that the ratio's a little weird - anyone have any ideas beyond the "yada yada discrimination yada yada"?

And actually, almost every person I regularly communicate with from my town applying RD is waiting for the mail. So they'll be finding out Monday/Tuesday, I guess, depending on how fast the post-people drive.

Thanks for the entry! One of your qutoed comments is mine, which makes me very surprised!!! :)

To all the rejectee whose maturity isn't equal to their intelligence, stop making immature statements! Even though you can't make it this year, but if MIT is truly your dream school, you should now start to plan and think how to make it one day instead of going to various forums and blogs, saying all the destructive criticisms. If all you said was true, I wonder why you even attempt to apply to MIT. :P

Oh, and I'll be at CPW without a doubt, because I'm just awesome like that. ^_^

Is it realistic for waitlisted folks to harbor *any* hopes at all? Even if some one does get in, would it be too late to get any decent financial aid from MIT? Could you please give your perspective even if it is just a guess?

I really hope the admissions committee remembered me as a real person and not just some applicant with the right "numbers." And even though they ultimately decided that I wasn't right for their class, I'll still always think well of MIT. Visiting and staying with my friend was one of the coolest experiences I have ever had.

And since I'll never be able to meet you (or maybe I will? Who knows?), I just want to let you and all the other bloggers know that you are great people. Really.

Farewell, MIT.

As science and technology fields have a strong history of discrimination against women-- MIT has openly acknowledged this, and I've seen examples of it in my own experience-- many such women are discouraged from even pursuing a field that they would potentially have a passion for. Probably the only way to rectify this is to aim for a more even male-female balance in those fields, and, as MIT has well more qualified applicants than it can accept, it chooses some well-qualified females over well-qualified males. As a rejected male, I still support this policy, but O! how it sucks to have to pay for the crimes of our fathers.

I'm waiting for the mail. :} I think I'm extremely in the minority, though; I seem to be the single, solitary person on College Confidential who hasn't gotten my descision yet. XD

yup...I was rejected...and I'm still haunting this place:) Sad I won't get to meet you...but hope I get to visit in the next few years...I'm definitely going to drop by:P

are u real MIT students? :D thats cool..

OMG im so excited I got in! Im glad you said something about what's been commented on blogs on here and not just ignoring it. I hope I meet you CPW!

Hmmm...getting rejected at MIT is tough, especially when things have also taken an incomprehensible turn for the worse in several other activities I've been dedicated to longer than I've been dedicated to getting in to MIT.

Nonetheless, I have to move on. Living in a world of pity won't help me solve those double and triple integrals that are coming up in Calc III.

Thanks to you Laura... I'm glad I stuck around a little longer before officially moving on from the MIT blog phase of my life! This addiction is hard to kick though I must say. I've been quoted "If anything, I've learned to resist my urge to be a workaholic and enjoy the journey more." This is so true for me though!! Getting rejected from MIT has brought me closer to my family and made me realize just how much I love math and science because of the sadness I felt when I found out that I wouldn't be able to pursue them at MIT. However, this is the second time I've been quoted on the blogs, maybe this is a sign I should be a writer or something.. haha, who knows?. I just wanted to make some final parting comments- please, please, don't feel worthless if you were not accepted! There has been talk of ppl. not even wanting to pursue a higher education b/c of the rejection, and this makes me extremely sad. As I have said before, anyone who was even in the position to apply to MIT is most definitely not a loser. You probably among the top 5% of highly educated ppl. in the entire world, and that is nothing to sneeze at. It is compelling hearing all of your stories, and it has been great. Maybe I will see some of you wherever I end up going... It is going to be the time of my life and education... I can smell the opportunity waiting for me. I truly believe we can't even fathom the possiblity of the future. Anyone who wants to talk my aim is dchica88. I applied to Harvard, Princton, Northwestern, Cornell and have already been accepted at Rochester. I would love to hear from you if you are thinking about any of these places. My final post... adeiu, adeiu, adeiu..

"We know what we are, but know not what we may be." (Ophelia) -Hamlet, Act IV, Scene V

Any sort of weight given to general femaleness does seem unfair. They shouldn't even look at gender when reading through applications, I think...

On the other hand, the Course 6 males are probably much, much happier with the current system.

I waited for the mail and I got it today =)

Woo, I was ok during the day, but by the time I got home, I was a nervous wreck (reading the rejection/waitlisted blogs at 3 am didn't help...so many amazing people got rejected, and I honestly thought I had no chance). I got in though!!! The shock is slowly beginning to wear off, and I'm getting more and more excited as the evening goes on (perfect for giving me energy to stay up late and finish homework).

Question: How much do you suggest we go to CPW? I'm playing at Carnegie Hall the weekend before, and I'm missing 3 days of school because of that, so if I miss 5 straight days, my teachers are liable to send me a low-scholarship =/ I was at one of the summer programs, but my RA said that MIT in the summer is very different from MIT during the school year.

So, I'm the one that was apparently, according to thekeri, 'appalled' at the admissions statistics for women at MIT. I feel a need to defend myself, as I have been grossly misunderstood. Here is an excerpt from my original entry:

"According to Mr. Nance, everyone who is accepted is qualified, and I'm sure that that's true. However, the disparity between those numbers is a little odd [27% acceptance rate females, 12% males], and I find it hard to believe that girls are that much more qualified than guys. This is not an accusation or an excuse for myself, but merely a curious inquiry. "

I found the source by the way, it was

http://web.mit.edu/ir/cds/2005/c.html

I want to say that I have the same feeling that Kathleen has when it comes to the MIT Admissions swaying decisions based on gender. Like Nance once said, MIT is a meritocracy, and thus I don't think that gender ought to be an issue when evaluating applicants. I mean, I fully support women in the engineering world, more than anything I can assure you, especially after that ridiculous article posted by the Harvard president several years back. However, to give someone weight (as it SEEMS, I don't know if that is true, it is entirely possible that the women applying are more than twice as competitive as the guys!) seems a little unfair, especially at a place trying to build leaders in the sciences out of the absolute best. And perhaps it is just my environment, but I don't see very much active discrimination against women becoming scientists or engineers, I think it's a choice, and that we all have equal opportunites. Because of that, women are really just as qualified as the guys to get in and shouldn't get a handicap when it comes to applications. Of course, I am not saying that if this were so, I would have gotten in, the applicant pool was very competitive and qualified, but it's just something I believe that should be discussed anyway. What do you think?

Man I wish other schools had admissions blogs... I have nowhere else to waste my time!

Hi! One of the quoted comments was mine. I will again try my best for the MIT Graduate School. :-)

Thanks for this wonderful post, Laura.

Best wishes :-)

Wenhao Sun: As many have written before me - MIT gets an amazing number of fantastic applications (yours was most likely one of them) so they get to choose which qualities they want to see in their class. An important quality of an MIT class is apparently its diversity. this means that they try to have a 1:1 ratio of girls to boys (or a 1.5:0.5 ratio of x to y chromosomes (i hope i haven't miscalculated here - it's late and i'm still at work.. ) and in general many different people.

hope you have a great college experience all the same - i for instance certainly will try to use the "erasmus"-program of the EC to see different universities during my studies.

Thanks, Laura!

Wenhao Sun: I understand that you are disappointed, but I think you need to take a valuable lesson from this. Read your statement again:

"I am disgusted and appalled that MIT is taking anything with two X chromosomes, and directly discriminating against asians. The fact that I was rejected for factors that I could not control infuriates me. And for what? For the sake of 'diversity?' So some course 6 nerd can have a girlfriend?"

In not so many words, you've said that you are more qualified than EVERY woman who was accepted to MIT. How else is it an injustice that MIT took "anything with two X chromosomes"? I seriously doubt that you are that qualified. If you were, you would have been accepted.

Honestly, MIT can be a rough place. Every student faces some concept, project, or problem set that they just can't tackle on their own. A large part of being successful at MIT is understanding your own limitations and being humble enough to ask for help. If this is how you handle adversity, it is probably for the best that you will never face the obstacles MIT puts in front of all of its students.

Sincerely,

An MIT Alum with Two X Chromosomes

Wenhao Sun:

I suggest you reread Nance's latest post.

"I am particularly pleased with the diversity of this class. For many there is a perception that the only way to increase diversity is to 'relax the standards'. I can't speak for other Colleges/Universities, but that is not the case at MIT. Everyone had to withstand close scrutiny and examination before being admitted. PERIOD."

thekeri's already addressed the male:female issue quite well; it's due to different numbers of applicants for each sex. And if you just look at numbers and nothing else, Asian Americans are NOT discrimated--there are at least 26% for the class of 2008. (see the who's at MIT portal on my.mit.edu).

If you have to, make tequila with your lemons, but don't be souring the admission staff's compassion and hard work. Nobody has any obligation to blog, to give you a good feel for the outs and ins of MIT. It would have been so much easier, if there weren't blogs, to relax after reading apps days and nights without any hate flung at them.

MIT stinks Laura.It does sucks.

It's interesting to look at the girl/guy thing -- I think you have to consider (completely stereotypically and unsupported by evidence) that if a slightly-underqualified guy is going to apply somewhere, it's more likely that it would be a tech-y school, simply because of guy's interests. Girls, on the other hand, are more likely to apply to the Ivies and lib. arts-y schools. As I said, I don't claim this as truth -- more like my own perception of the world.

Therefore, the female pool self-selects itself more than the male, as only the most focused and science-oriented girls will apply.

(It's sort of like there are only 4 girls on my robotics team out of 25 people, but two of us were on the drive team because we were the most dedicated. Self-selecting pool.)

Hope that made a bit of sense.

Did you guys read Wenhao Sun's comment right before yours (Vicki/Shen)? "Because of that, women are really just as qualified as the guys to get in and shouldn't get a handicap when it comes to applications. Of course, I am not saying that if this were so, I would have gotten in, the applicant pool was very competitive and qualified, but it's just something I believe that should be discussed anyway." Comments like this: "In not so many words, you've said that you are more qualified than EVERY woman who was accepted to MIT. How else is it an injustice that MIT took "anything with two X chromosomes"? I seriously doubt that you are that qualified. If you were, you would have been accepted," and, "It would have been so much easier, if there weren't blogs, to relax after reading apps days and nights without any hate flung at them," in all due respect, don't reflect that you did.

ohhh urr LauraN from CC! ohh sorry i didn't get that connection right away :P

thanks for comment on cpw. im glad u brought this issue out to the open - i had to prevent myself "ranting" on CC too several times. haha.

I'll try to meet u in person at CPW! excitedd

Phil (getalife1234)

Anonymous asked if I had read Wenhao Sun's follow-up comment, and the answer is yes, I did. Had his initial response been, "I am disappointed I didn't get into MIT and would like to understand more about how the class is constructed.", I think he would have started a postive conversation. Instead, he insulted every woman who was admitted in the class of 2010, both by implying that they were unqualified and by using derogatory language ("anything with two X chromosomes"). Even in his apology, he goes on to say that "[he doesn't] see very much active discrimination against women becoming scientists or engineers", even though his FIRST reaction was discriminatory. He is exhibiting the very behavior he claims doesn't exist. I don't see how his apology corrects his initial behavior; therefore, I can't let him off the hook that easily.

To try and move the conversation to the positive, Caroline hit the nail on the head. Fewer women apply to technical schools like MIT, but those that do apply tend to be more qualified. Women self-select, so you don't get as many borderline female applicants. Therefore, you can admit a higher percentage of female applicants without having to accept any unqualified candidates.

Someone may have already said this, because I was a bit too lazy to read all the comments, but I'll go ahead and put in my two cents anyways. :)

From what I've seen from past MIT admissions statistics, yes, it is a little easier to get in if you are female. In the application year of 2003-2004, it was about 16% easier (11% vs 27%, if you're interested). Statistically, it certainly seems very unfair. But there are a couple of factors we must consider. First of all, we don't know if this is still true. Two years is a pretty long time - and other statistics indicate that more and more women are applying to tech schools and that MIT is getting harder and harder to get into. Secondly, you have what Vicki said. (I was about to type it out myself when I saw her post).

And you know what? Guys have the advantage at liberal arts schools, so it's an equal trade-off. It's not like girls everywhere are accepted more often that guys. Affirmative action is a sticky topic, whether it regards gender, race, or anything else, but I really don't think it calls for such a hateful (written! public!) comment, no matter how angry you are.

Snazzy post there, Laura. That's the kind of advice I had to take on in full after being deferred from EA. It wasn't easy to take, but I did my best to understand that the world does not, in fact, revolve around me. That sounds a lot more egocentric than it should... but the essence is important: I couldn't blame MIT or anyone else for the setback. And, after all the stress and additional applications, the admissions committee decided to give me a shot - I couldn't be more thankful.

I'll back you up 110% on your second final thought, as well. College Board has quite the monopoly on the test-taking bracket. As the most recent error in their systems again demonstrated, such a singularly charged site can send major shockwaves out when not tempered by another force. My test scores weren't great in the end, but I felt that they were a good reflection of myself - talented, but not perfect.

The MIT offices state in their admissions advice that they aren't looking for carbon copies, and for that I respect the school all the more. 2400's are not, as you say, not get-into-MIT-free cards. Worthy of respect, yes, but no single number should ever determine one's future life.

And yes, absolutely! - programming is dead sexy. My girlfriend's presently immersed in the world of journalism at NYU, which is equally sexy, but the computer sciences hold some great beauties; intelligent and attractive.

But discrimintation one way or the other on the gender issue should be discarded immediately; the report I read in "The Tech" this week said that the ratio of "male : female" was "52 : 48." Not much in the way of a female advantage, if you ask me. These numbers may be skewed a bit, but I can't imagine that they're too far off. The only real advantage that women have is the relative disinterest among their same-sex peers. Even then, as Dally points out, more women have been getting into the science & engineering fields, and as such I expect that the acceptance trend over the next ten years will further equalize the ratios.

Also, if I may take a small side-jab at my own gender, our immaturity at raising this issue and subsequently whining about it probably doesn't give us a strong recommendation, eh? Just something to consider...

In any event, I'll close up my shpeel. Again, it's a very nice post, Laura. I hope it provides solace for those that have been troubled by the unpleasant response that MIT sent them; I know I would have appreciated these same sentiments if I were in those shoes.

Hope to see ya around at CPW, Laura. I wonder how much of a chance I'll have of actually finding you, but I guess only time will tell.

'Till then!

Is it possible to apply for transfer?? I saw on the MIT fact that they only accepted about 14 transfers last year. do u know the rate of acceptance for transfers?? I really want to apply fo transfer and I am planning to do it maybe one and a half years later.

HEY

I did NOT post this comment:

"I am disgusted and appalled that MIT is taking anything with two X chromosomes, and directly discriminating against asians. The fact that I was rejected for factors that I could not control infuriates me. And for what? For the sake of 'diversity?' So some course 6 nerd can have a girlfriend?"

Please read Laura's next blog.

Heh...as a potential course 6'er, I'm glad they're keeping our moral in mind j/k ^_^

Hm. I can understand the sentiments of most of the people who were rejected. The acceptance as something I would like to show if (God Forbid!!) I am rejected but the anger and angst is what I probably would have. Not against MIT, but against something. It would go away in 15 minutes leaving me exausted and then I would probably just collapse.

Oh yeah and the thing I found most amusing was the Asian discrimination. I would have accepted someone saying Caucasians were being discriminated against (A joke!). And no, I'm not racist. No more than an average human being.(Which is still a lot). Also, Sorry for the inevitable spelling errors etc. etc.